Feedback to Tiertime

[JothamB]

Hi guys, just got some feedback:

Things that don’t work well:

1. The hour counter on my UP300 has stopped working
2. when the router the printer is connected to has no internet the printer will pause at random (I think this is the reason, happened multiple times last night).
3. BOTH the pulley idlers on my UP300 have broken on me mid print, a few months one after the other.
4. Connecting to the printer is often problematic. If it isn’t connecting I have to shut off the PC and the printer at the same time, then turn both back on to be able to connect. Using the machine with multiple computers is impossible as the one PC blocks the other user from connecting even if upstudio is closed before attempting to connect on the 2nd PC.
5. Printing from USB isn’t working. I literally cannot print anything off a thumb drive - maybe there is a way but I cannot figure it out.
6. The outer perimeter to infill gap issue is still present, well over a year after being reported. How is this still not fixed? This is a BIG problem, serious, all parts produced on this printer are weak compared to competing products. Tolerances are excellent, but don’t expect them to be strong.
7. Every once in a while, the printer’s touchscreen software will crash and become non-responsive. there’s a whole variety of errors, the latest one I had last night was: “[900] error: material breaks” which makes no sense. There’s a bunch more I might have to dig them up from my photos on my phone.
8. I need to have internet connectivity to print anything on upstudio (why?)
9. If I try to do a 45hr print with about 12 or more parts on the print bed UPStudio or the printer will crash, try it. You will see.
10. I want to be able to just use GCODE on the printer due to the above issues.
11. All it has to do, is accept gcode, no touchscreen and I would be happier with the printer.
12. It is loud. I would suggest in future to use trinamic silent stepstick drivers.
13. The Y axis motor cable rubs on the powder coated frame and looks like its at risk of wearing through the insulation. I’ve put some tape on it to protect it.

As a user I do not feel listened to, and its like I’m using a beta product that is touted as being ready for industrial use.
Would I recommend this printer to new comers? Depends on what your needs are.

Let’s talk about what the UP300 does right:

The hardware.

1. the machine is SOLID. I’ve only ever needed to level the bed once, even after some heavy duty print removal prying action with my putty knife.The bed level is set and forget (mechanically level it using the knobs under the bed - forget software leveling. use that to verify you’re level).

2. I love the switchable print bed system. The cable management using the flex cables is awesome. These will last a very very long time and are easy to change if required.

3. The quick change extruder assemblies is a great idea. Brilliant when something goes wrong and you can just drop another one, fix the blocked one later.

4. Really tough heavy sheet metal construction.

I’ve spent a lot of time with this machine, it’s got potential. It just needs more love from the engineers.

[Jason-TT]

Thanks JothamB, for this detailed feedback. Here are some quick answer from my knowledge.

1. The hour counter on my UP300 has stopped working
   Reply: Would you provide a photo showing the current hour counter value? we will check what happened

2. when the router the printer is connected to has no internet the printer will pause at random (I think this is the reason, happened multiple times last night).
   Reply: We will check what happened for this one

3. BOTH the pulley idlers on my UP300 have broken on me mid print, a few months one after the other.
   Reply: this is an issue of a specific batch.

4. Connecting to the printer is often problematic. If it isn’t connecting I have to shut off the PC and the printer at the same time, then turn both back on to be able to connect. Using the machine with multiple computers is impossible as the one PC blocks the other user from connecting even if upstudio is closed before attempting to connect on the 2nd PC.
   Reply: The printer cannot be connected to multiple device at the same time, so one user’s connection will block other users from connecting. Try update to latest Touchscreen firmware

5. Printing from USB isn’t working. I literally cannot print anything off a thumb drive - maybe there is a way but I cannot figure it out.
   Reply: some USB disks are not compatible for unknown reason, also make sure the disk is in FAT32 format, otherwise cannot be read by printer. Usually switch to another USB drive works for most users.

6. The outer perimeter to infill gap issue is still present, well over a year after being reported. How is this still not fixed? This is a BIG problem, serious, all parts produced on this printer are weak compared to competing products. Tolerances are excellent, but don’t expect them to be strong.
   Reply: We found the bug for this issue in the slicer algorithm of UP Studio. IT will created a cumulative error during slicing, so the taller the model the more shift of infill toward one side of perimeter (usually to the right). This is most obvious when process a tall model with thin layers. This problem will be solve in UP Studio 3.

7. Every once in a while, the printer’s touchscreen software will crash and become non-responsive. there’s a whole variety of errors, the latest one I had last night was: “[900] error: material breaks” which makes no sense. There’s a bunch more I might have to dig them up from my photos on my phone.
   Reply:For touchscreen crash all the time, we suggest you contact support, we will provide touchscreen replacement.
   Material breaks means the filament sensor did not detect material during a print, so may be the filament just ran out

8. I need to have internet connectivity to print anything on upstudio (why?)
   Reply:Absolutely no, it should able to work completely offline. Nor Up Studio require internet connection.Only the activation of printer requires internet for once. In the future we consider use software registration to replace the hardware activation as it is causing unnecessary troubles.

9. If I try to do a 45hr print with about 12 or more parts on the print bed UPStudio or the printer will crash, try it. You will see.
   Reply:Current UP Studio indeed has issue when processing very large models with very fine layers. This will not be an issue of UP Studio 3, the slicer’s capability is very much the same as Catfish. For printer crash, again recommend contact support for touchscreen replacement

10. I want to be able to just use GCODE on the printer due to the above issues.
    REply: Will support Gcode, we are working on it. However for Gcodes from other slicer we cannot guarantee the printer will work and most likely need extra time for optimization

11. All it has to do, is accept gcode, no touchscreen and I would be happier with the printer.
    Reply:same as above

12. It is loud. I would suggest in future to use trinamic silent stepstick drivers.
    Reply: be a choice in future

13. The Y axis motor cable rubs on the powder coated frame and looks like its at risk of wearing through the insulation. I’ve put some tape on it to protect it.
    Reply:Checked, should not be a problem but no harm to add more protection.

UP300 has a printer core that has been developed and iterated for 5+ years, so we are very confident about the printing performance. Just the new embedded system causing all the small but annoying issues. UP300/UP mini2es are the first 2 models that have Linux embedded system, there are some hardware and software issue related to this new system. We are continuously working on the system to make it better.

[JothamB]

Thank you for the quick reply Jason.

1. • The hour counter on my UP300 has stopped working
     Reply: Would you provide a photo showing the current hour counter value? we will check what happened
     Here is the hour counter: The last firmware upgrade also reset the Total Weight counter to 0 kg, but has since started counting, but the hours has remained 0.1h
     
     
2. • when the router the printer is connected to has no internet the printer will pause at random (I think this is the reason, happened multiple times last night).
     Reply: We will check what happened for this one
     Thanks.
     .
     .
3. • BOTH the pulley idlers on my UP300 have broken on me mid print, a few months one after the other.
     Reply: this is an issue of a specific batch.
     Thanks, good to know its just one batch. I’ve got replacements already so that is resolved.
     .
     .
4. • Connecting to the printer is often problematic. If it isn’t connecting I have to shut off the PC and the printer at the same time, then turn both back on to be able to connect. Using the machine with multiple computers is impossible as the one PC blocks the other user from connecting even if upstudio is closed before attempting to connect on the 2nd PC.
     Reply: The printer cannot be connected to multiple device at the same time, so one user’s connection will block other users from connecting. Try update to latest Touchscreen firmware
     Okay, I will try update to the latest. I fear to update the firmware - some time ago I updated the firmware, but the new firmware was too new for UPStudio. I had to wait a day until the new UPStudio was released and then I could print again. This might sound odd, but it actually happened and I could not continue production of my parts. Even having the one PC on, and upstudio closed, still means it is blocking the connection somehow. Again I will try update and find out if this resolves the issue.
     .
     .
5. • Printing from USB isn’t working. I literally cannot print anything off a thumb drive - maybe there is a way but I cannot figure it out.
     Reply: some USB disks are not compatible for unknown reason, also make sure the disk is in FAT32 format, otherwise cannot be read by printer. Usually switch to another USB drive works for most users.
     Brilliant, I tested this and now it works. I must read instructions first before complaining.
     .
     .
6. • The outer perimeter to infill gap issue is still present, well over a year after being reported. How is this still not fixed? This is a BIG problem, serious, all parts produced on this printer are weak compared to competing products. Tolerances are excellent, but don’t expect them to be strong.
     We found the bug for this issue in the slicer algorithm of UP Studio. IT will created a cumulative error during slicing, so the taller the model the more shift of infill toward one side of perimeter (usually to the right). This is most obvious when process a tall model with thin layers. This problem will be solve in UP Studio 3. Yes, and we are waiting a long time now. Is a bug fix not possible?
     .
     .
7. • Every once in a while, the printer’s touchscreen software will crash and become non-responsive. there’s a whole variety of errors, the latest one I had last night was: “[900] error: material breaks” which makes no sense. There’s a bunch more I might have to dig them up from my photos on my phone.
     Reply:For touchscreen crash all the time, we suggest you contact support, we will provide touchscreen replacement.
     Material breaks means the filament sensor did not detect material during a print, so may be the filament just ran out
     Thank you, I will get in touch with my distributor. It is not crashing all the time, but enough to be a problem.
     Interesting it certainly had filament in it (about 800g) and there was no filament break.
     .
     .
8. • I need to have internet connectivity to print anything on upstudio (why?)
     Reply:Absolutely no, it should able to work completely offline. Nor Up Studio require internet connection.Only the activation of printer requires internet for once. In the future we consider use software registration to replace the hardware activation as it is causing unnecessary troubles.
     Ok. Well, somehow I got logged out of UPStudio and wasn’t able to connect until I signed back in, which required an internet connection.
     .
     .
9. • If I try to do a 45hr print with about 12 or more parts on the print bed UPStudio or the printer will crash, try it. You will see.
     Reply:Current UP Studio indeed has issue when processing very large models with very fine layers. This will not be an issue of UP Studio 3, the slicer’s capability is very much the same as Catfish. For printer crash, again recommend contact support for touchscreen replacement
     What is the expected release date of UPStudio 3? Being able to print a large number of parts is something I expect to be able to do.
     .
     .
10. • I want to be able to just use GCODE on the printer due to the above issues.
      REply: Will support Gcode, we are working on it. However for Gcodes from other slicer we cannot guarantee the printer will work and most likely need extra time for optimization
      That is okay. See the reason I ask for this feature is because of all the problems I’m having. With my other 3D printers I use Simplify3D which has been extremely reliable.
      .
      .
11. • All it has to do, is accept gcode, no touchscreen and I would be happier with the printer.
      Reply:same as above
      :+1
      .
      .
12. • It is loud. I would suggest in future to use trinamic silent stepstick drivers.
      Reply: be a choice in future
      Great.
      .
      .
13. • The Y axis motor cable rubs on the powder coated frame and looks like its at risk of wearing through the insulation. I’ve put some tape on it to protect it.
      Reply:Checked, should not be a problem but no harm to add more protection.
      Ok, good to know.

UP300 has a printer core that has been developed and iterated for 5+ years, so we are very confident about the printing performance. Just the new embedded system causing all the small but annoying issues. UP300/UP mini2es are the first 2 models that have Linux embedded system, there are some hardware and software issue related to this new system. We are continuously working on the system to make it better.
Small but annoying issues can really cause me problems. It only takes one to cause a print to fail. I have clients, I have deadlines. Problems cost me time and materials. I need reliable solutions that work and are reliable. Good to hear you are working on a solution, but this is why I say it feels like I am using a beta product. That’s not what I signed up for. I’ll get in touch with the local distributor.

[JothamB]

Today the printer filament jammed again. Here is what I found:

The gear has ground the filament. Look closely at the back:

Please enlarge the image and have a close look.

It looks like it has put a line over the same line. This print plate was 100% scraped clean before I started this print. I scrapped all of it clean, then applied some ABS/acetone slush to increase adhesion to the board. I am 100% certain that is not a piece of filament left from the last print. The extruder jammed because the gear ground the filament. The picture shows the 6 hours of finished printing. So now I have another print that is failed. I had this same issue 2 days ago. Jason have you seen this before and do you have a solution?

[JothamB]

Been a long time since I’ve seen this one. Last time support had me reseat the redblack twisted pair wiring going to the touchscreen on the main board in the back. I’ll get in touch with them and see what they say.

[JothamB]

I’ve just gotten home and my print looks like this:

I’ve re-measured the calibration height. It used to be set at 229.75mm. but now it appears 230.75mm is the correct value for the nozzle to almost touch the bed (I’m feeling with a paper in between the nozzle and bed to find the correct height). Weird. I adjusted the calibration height to be correct.
I’ve checked that there is no rubbish in the way of the Z axis limit switch.

I started the print again:

Same thing again. So I cancelled the print and immediately went to the calibration menu, and moved it up to the 230.75 and was able to verify that the set height was correct.

I’ve resent it a new file. Turned the printer off, then on again. I’ve re-verified the calibration height value is correct. So I printed the new file I sent it. I got the same result. It is far too high. I never have had this issue before.

What now? I need to print parts, I’ve got deadlines to get this stuff done.

[JothamB]

The bed has become unlevel. Solved. It was level for 1.5 years - never had issues with that till today.

Just did an autolevel:

I’ll adjust the screws till its almost perfect.

hurray!

EDIT: I just remembered, while the lid was open a spool of filament slid off the top and fell onto the print bed yesterday. This will have been the cause of the unlevelness. Sorry for the bother- you can ignore my last message

I have been up far too late at night changing prints keeping things working that I almost forgot that even happened.

The manual and autoleveling system are very nice. Work well.

[JothamB]

UPDATE:

New touchscreen arrived today. I’ve just finished installing it (with ESD precautions being taken, wriststrap taking care on what I’m touching etc…), and I have updated it to the latest firmware (1.5.10 as of time of writing).

All seems to be going well so far.

For others perhaps passing by later or finding this via googling:
if you get:
Error: Model Out of Print Range: There are models outside the forming space or models smaller than the print layer thickness. (4.4.402.402.401)

Then remember to set the nozzle calibration height under the calibration menu on the touchscreen. New touch screen had a default value of 0.00mm, so of course, anything I try print is outside the possible print area. I probably would have known to do this if I went through the official documentation step by step I’m guessing.

That’s solved that. Thanks @Tama and @Jason-TT for the spare parts - much appreciated!
Rock on