Not happy with cetus mk3

I am not happy with my printer. Even wished that i never bought this piece of crap! First there was a problem of again and again needed to calibrade leveling the bed. Solution: the Y-axis need to tentioned to the Z-axis. Bravo tiertime! Then clicking noises. Printed a filament tentioner, did not help. Cleaned the nozzle, did not help, tried several temperature settings (within factory advise), not helped, tried a other nozzle, did not help, contacted tiertime, did not help. They say that the nozzle was to close to the bed. I tried that, with a new nozzle, half way down, clicking noizes. I paused the proces and extruded some filament; there was a huge amount of clicking noizes! I tried to retract the filament, the filament was stuck! I had to use alot force to get the filament out. Now i have bigger problems; the Z-axis have to reprair. The belt is not attacted anymore. At that moment i was completely done and almost throw it out of the window! i am furious!
With the clicking noizes, the whole printhead shakes!

I bought this printer because people said it was effortless. No thinkering of any kind. One even said: i would not give a d… give me the part! That was my trigger to buy this printer. First of all, i want the use the printer as a tool, not to print nick nacks. I was so wrong!

I used the nozzles: 0.2 - 0.4 and 0.6 (0.4 started the problems)
Filament: Das filament; right out of the sealed package
Best results is to leave setting as is.

@Arie55 , would you like some help from this community?

Yes, that would be great!

Arie

I also use my Cetus for functional parts, mostly building prototypes.

Sometimes, even with expensive equipment, quality-control misses things that could create many differing problems when we try to use the equipment for it’s intended purpose. Without having the printer in front of me, zeroing-in on the problems will be difficult…some of the stuff I ask may not make sense why I ask and you may become frustrated…but hang-in there…it’s all part of a successful troubleshooting process, I’ve been doing this for many decades.

To start, I’m going to need a video recording, did you get the z-axis belt fixed? If yes, then record a video at the start of printing process. The camera must be absolutely still, and I need to see from the top-of-the-motor to the tip-of-the-nozzle…so you will have to remove the fan and the air-ducting.

Exacly what i did not wanted to do, trouble shooting. I needed a printer that prints my parts. And i know that there will be compromises like one z-axis (some instabillity), proprietary software, parts and so on. If it took only his own filament, i did never bought this printer. Even thougt of replacing the electronics and printhead. But then i spend money what i do not want to spend AND then i had better bought a printer that you have to do in the first place to get it work.

I can make a video recording, but i do not know how to upload it. Photo’s is not a problem. But i will investigate it.
But, i don’t understand that you wanted to see such details. The whole head shakes (0.4 nozzle). What it makes so diffucult, is that the clicking does it not all the time. When it does not doing clicking for a while (replacement of the nozzle from 0.4 to 0.6 and then to 0.2) it gave me hope. After a night printing i heard it softly clicking and pauzed the printing. Then i extruded the filament manualy and the clicking was louder and! the nozzle was clogged. Then the problems start.

The pinter is now (for the second time i owned it in 3-4 months) almost completely diassembled. No, i have not repare the z-axis yet. First i must go through some mourning period and regain my drive to repair it.

here the photo of the piece out of the nozzle

I’m sorry to hear (and share) your experience with Tiertime support. Shame when so many are so pleased, and you get a monday edition and no help it feels very frustrating…

Probably pointing you in the “wrong” direction, but with the sub $30 32 bits boarsd that come with the new TMC2209 drivers I’d hesitate to not replace the board and get rid of Up Studio. (disclaimer, I haven’t tried the Cheetah board yet as its still in transit, but on paper the Ali express Cheetah board should be a great fit for Tiertime printers as most of the connectors are the same and its easy to buy/make adapter for the bed and print head.)

Arie55, i totally agree with your experience and i’m sorry. I’ve been praising the Cetus as a perfect effortless printer and the MkII was exactly that. The Mk3 though is completely the opposite. Its such a lie and support is useless now. I’m guessing the Mk1 &2 were someones project and now the tiertime management are running things and fucked it all up. The mk3 has no upgrades, out of the box its a mk2 and you have to buy extras before you can buy the upgrades, all of which are incompatible. To get the printer we all want (heated bed, steel nozzle, alignment probe etc) we have to buy a printer then throw away half its parts and but replacements as the parts supplied cant be used for the mk3 platform. Its a scam and a price hike on top. Documentation with missing steps that will possibly cause you to electrocute yourself and fry the printer. This is why people dont buy Made In China products . Its lies and fraud.

@Bjorn

You describe it nice: a monday edition :wink: you don’t have to be sorry… but your described path, is somthing what i had think about too. It looks then i design my own printer. What as an mechanical engineer not so diffecult is to do. But in the end i would have spend a lot of money to buy the best parts (about 400+ euro) and been unsure that the machine will work. As they say; a machine is more than its parts.

So, i can search and find one of the best/better printhead assembly. Let say that it will cost about 100 euro. Probably more. Then good electronics with the best motor drivers, about another 100 euros. And also probably more. That means over 200 euros investment and still not sure that it will give a solution. I think that this path would not be taken.

What i can do is repair it and if its end of his live i buy a other rigid machine and upgrade it to my standards. Or end this first adventure… What i don’t understand, why it is still impossible to make a good printer that works! 300-400 euros is more that adequate. It is so sour that i have only something more than a kg of filament printed and had so many problems. If i had purchased it in the Netherlands, i could go back to the store. Then it was there problem and or my money back.

@Sil
hmmm… weird. I ordered a MK2 and because it was not on stock i got a MK3. I thought it was a good deal.
A heated bed was not on my list. For me it was even a plus, it means less power consumption. I think that made in China has nothing to do with bad products. You pay for what you get. The lies and fraud is in the west even so bad. Only it is more disguised.
I even found out that there was some drawings and Bill Of Materials (BOM). But i ignore that. I could do that on my own. That printer would cost with parts allone 500-600 euros, or so. As a starter, i found that too much. You can say now: tuition fees.

Arie

Look at the link, TMC2209 is the latest offering from Trinamic, specifically designed for 3d printing and “small”, “low cost” consumer printers. $30 for board with drivers is dirt cheap. Of course I will stick to my Duet 3d board, but wanted to have a play with the new 32 bit boards with the TMC2209 drivers.

And yeah I feel ya; IF my local vendor had provided support according to (EU/EEC) regulations I wouldn’t have had to get a refund through the payment provider and I would have considered buying a new printer when I got refund though the payment provider. Certainly glad I didnt buy direct from Tiertime.

I have a MK3 and I don’t have serious problems with it. A problem common to ANY 3D printer is nozzle clog. Even a Prusa or a > $2K Ultimaker clogs.

I have experienced that too but, I’ve sorted it out. Leveling/tramming, easy. Replacing the board, more so, talking about Trinamic drivers won’t solve your problems.

Here’s what I do when if and when the nozzle gets clogged - http://roadtonirvana.net/diy/Cetus3D-nozzle-unblock.htm

During assembly, I made sure the Cetus is level/trammed properly, here’s how I did it - http://roadtonirvana.net/diy/Cetus3D-leveling.htm

My MK3 just works, with proper maintenance.

Thanks Arnold!

I will clean the nozzle as mentioned in the link. Also a good tip if you were not using the printer to get the filament out. I did left the filament in, even more then your 2 days. Sometimes weeks. probably thats why it went good when i use a new nozzle for a while.

About leveling the bed; yes, that was horribly. When i leveled the bed the last time, it was less then 0.1 mm off in Y-directon. In X-direction was it a bit more. It can be done in that direction, but after a few prints the level in that direction is off again. This by removing te part. Sometimes it is so stuck!
What i did notice by disassemble the printer, was that the Y-axis screws were again not realy tight. When i put it together, i am going to put spring washers under the screws.

Indeed proper maintenance, but you do have to know these things! or someone like you to mentioned it.

Then again… the latest problems accur when the printer was already 12-13 hours continuously printing.

Arie

Yes, withdrawing the filament when the Cetus will not be in use helps a lot too.

Hello

Clicking noise….is that extruder stepper motor missing steps, means can’t feed the extrusion head?

Nozzle temperature correct?

NTC (T° feedback loop) OK?

Filament temparature not too low?

On my side, I bought 3 Cetus 3D MK2: the first: brand new…then 2 others: “as-is” supposed to be faulty ones, sold for parts. To repair those 2 was just too easy. Since, no printing issue on any of those 3.

Probably a bug/failure you missed on yours

Hope you will find it soon

Best regards

S.T.

Feedback

I have cleaned the nozzle as Arnold sugested. Somethings i noticed:

[0.2mm] the manual extruded filament curled around the nozzle as a curl of wool. That is, IF the filament came out. Otherwise nothing came out and the clicking begon. With a redraw came the end kind of strange out. A thin string with a blob at the end. Have even the nozzle take apart to drill out the filament. Gave no solution.

[0.4mm] almost the same as 0.2mm, but after several extrude, redraw cleaning, the filament went straight out. Only for a while, then clicking.

[0.6mm] went after cleaning the best of all. Very soon the filament came straight out of the nozzle. Also the redraw looks very smooth.

Then i got a idea to use the end of the 0.2mm (steel part) and screw it on the 0.4mm. After some manual extrusion, the filament went straight out of the nozzle. Also after the cleaned out nozzles the redrawed filament was pointed at the end. No blob. I tried a small print and that went good. Last night a bigger part and that went also good. At 2-3 AM the part was done. This morning i did a manual extrusion and the filament went again the filament came curled out. After two times extruding it went ok.

I had in the mean time some interaction with tiertime. The only solution what they came with, was leveling the bed. I wrote what i had done and seen. Just what i have done here. They going to sent me some parts. Kind of strange because a real what was going one is still kind of mistery.

What i have learned is that you can see the degree of pollution after a manual redraw. Begin before printing a part, do a manual extrusion. A curl of wool at the nozzle is not good! Stay away of settings which the beads came narrower to each other. Also the layer height, the best is half of the diameter of the nozzle. Less then that give troubbles.

What i still wanted to do, is the getting the printing plate realy horizontal. Now it goes all over the place. The Z- and Y-axis are perpendicular. And the Y-axis is whitin 0.1 mm parallel to the bed. Why is then the numbers in the leveling parameters so different?
The more i have to tinker with this machine, the more i have questions about the mechanical aspects of it. For over 300 euros you may expect a solid machine. The price of the parts is not the issue…

“ And the Y-axis is whitin 0.1 mm parallel to the bed. Why is then the numbers in the leveling parameters so different?”

Are you using a feeler gauge? If you have the stock bed, the surface is not even so you need a metal feeler gauge. Better solution is to put a 3mm glass (or mirror) on top of the stock bed and you can print without a raft. Nozzle to bed offset is 0.1 for 0.2 nozzle, and 0.2 for 0.4 nozzle.

Exactly! When i put the y-axis parallel to the bed, the bed is only on two places ok. The rest is off. Big time off.
I use paper, which is 0.1mm thick. But i want to look into the leveling of the bed in a mechanical way. Ones and for all. I become littlebit sick of it… I have to deal with the mechanical properties of the machine, which is not realy stable. Also notice that after leveling, a gap of 0.5mm is to low. 1mm is better, there is still some clicking by printing the raft.

on the left first layer with 0.5mm offset, on the right second layer. There was some huge clicking. When i made de offset 1mm, the clicking was much less. Still there, sometimes.

Using glass is perhaps a good idea. I put the machine onto a thick piece of wood. One of the rubber feet was not thouched the wood. It meanted the whole machine was twisted! After that was corrected, the foot under the x-axis motor was mounted with air locks. :slight_smile:
Before using glass, the bed has to be firm and not go anywhere. On the to-do list. A second hand gauge to measure this is also an option.

Arie

Looking at the middle of your build-plate, are there only two screws fastening the build-plate?

No, even not 3 by the factory but 4.

The clicking I’m sure is related to the settings the software uses to extrude rafts, which differs from the rest of the print. Its not a filament slip or nozzle touching bed issue. I think the motors used dont well handle the values being sent causing an uneven extrusion rate. you can also see the blob pattern in your photo where it extrudes for a bit then pauses and repeats. My instinct feels this is a rounding error as the values are not accurate enough to work with what the motor can handle in combination with axis motors. its like a moire interference pattern emerging. for a cetus this clicking is the new normal apparently :frowning: once the raft is done the print runs smooth with no clicking or blob pattern.

When my up mini does the same the nozzle is usually too close to the bed, and the unevenness of the bed causes it to be blocked for parts of the raft resulting in clicking and uneven extrusion for the other areas.